<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: You Can&#8217;t Trust Anyone These Days</title>
	<atom:link href="http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/</link>
	<description>A community for cyclists in Boston</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 02:57:29 -0400</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Boston Biker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Running Red Lights: Not Safe</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1880</link>
		<dc:creator>Boston Biker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Running Red Lights: Not Safe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 19:59:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1880</guid>
		<description>[...] will set aside for a moment the other consequences of running red lights and deal solely with the safety aspect of it. As far as I can tell, the main [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] will set aside for a moment the other consequences of running red lights and deal solely with the safety aspect of it. As far as I can tell, the main [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1791</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:11:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1791</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sure you&#039;re aware that when someone on a bike gets hit by a car, the cyclist gets blamed, even if the car driver is 100% at fault.  There are so many examples - but here&#039;s a nice one:

http://www.examiner.com/a-530243~Crash_spotlights_Octavia_and_Market_intersection.html

A truck driver makes an illegal right turn, hits a cyclist, puts her in the hospital with serious injuries, and he gets cited for nothing more than making an illegal right turn - $120 fine.  It&#039;s not in this particular article, but the truck driver dragged her bike for several miles after hitting her.

That&#039;s why, as a cyclist, you want to go through red lights if you judge it to be safe to do so.  So you can get ahead of the drivers who don&#039;t know and don&#039;t care the you&#039;re there.  And then they can&#039;t put you in the hospital.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;re aware that when someone on a bike gets hit by a car, the cyclist gets blamed, even if the car driver is 100% at fault.  There are so many examples &#8211; but here&#8217;s a nice one:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.examiner.com/a-530243~Crash_spotlights_Octavia_and_Market_intersection.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.examiner.com/a-530243~Crash_spotlights_Octavia_and_Market_intersection.html</a></p>
<p>A truck driver makes an illegal right turn, hits a cyclist, puts her in the hospital with serious injuries, and he gets cited for nothing more than making an illegal right turn &#8211; $120 fine.  It&#8217;s not in this particular article, but the truck driver dragged her bike for several miles after hitting her.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s why, as a cyclist, you want to go through red lights if you judge it to be safe to do so.  So you can get ahead of the drivers who don&#8217;t know and don&#8217;t care the you&#8217;re there.  And then they can&#8217;t put you in the hospital.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jazzercycle</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1789</link>
		<dc:creator>Jazzercycle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 01:27:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1789</guid>
		<description>I really don&#039;t understand the issue here.  For one, the law is stop at lights. Get over it and stop.  Until that law is changed you have to follow it. If you don&#039;t like it, go do some leg work and try and change it. Until then stop bitching. Be a productive person and don&#039;t add to the already crazy street issues we have.  Even if you belive that riders should not stop at red lights until the law changes, its illiegal.  And if it does, and you run a red light &quot;cause you can&quot; and you mis-judge a car coming and get hit, who&#039;s fault is it? Your going to blame the car going on a path through a green, that your allowed to run the red light so its their fault?  I really don&#039;t see the logic in that at all.  Maybe some of those smaller side street reds but basically a dumb idea in some of our major intersections.  And this crap about the roads built for cars and not for bikes, yeah maybe a little but the light system is built for everyone to be safe and to know whats coming.  I bike every day and I drive, and I have almost hit a buch of mornons running lights all over the place.  So now your saying while I am driving I now also have to look for bikes coming out of intersections where I have a green and they have a red?  Makes ZERO sense to me at all. Perhaps instead of practicing breaking the law to &quot;make a point or stand against it&quot; ALL people should be practicing patience at those lights. And if your in a rush perhaps you need to re-think how you  budget your time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really don&#8217;t understand the issue here.  For one, the law is stop at lights. Get over it and stop.  Until that law is changed you have to follow it. If you don&#8217;t like it, go do some leg work and try and change it. Until then stop bitching. Be a productive person and don&#8217;t add to the already crazy street issues we have.  Even if you belive that riders should not stop at red lights until the law changes, its illiegal.  And if it does, and you run a red light &#8220;cause you can&#8221; and you mis-judge a car coming and get hit, who&#8217;s fault is it? Your going to blame the car going on a path through a green, that your allowed to run the red light so its their fault?  I really don&#8217;t see the logic in that at all.  Maybe some of those smaller side street reds but basically a dumb idea in some of our major intersections.  And this crap about the roads built for cars and not for bikes, yeah maybe a little but the light system is built for everyone to be safe and to know whats coming.  I bike every day and I drive, and I have almost hit a buch of mornons running lights all over the place.  So now your saying while I am driving I now also have to look for bikes coming out of intersections where I have a green and they have a red?  Makes ZERO sense to me at all. Perhaps instead of practicing breaking the law to &#8220;make a point or stand against it&#8221; ALL people should be practicing patience at those lights. And if your in a rush perhaps you need to re-think how you  budget your time.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Today’s post, in which I make nice with LADOT &#171; BikingInLA</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1788</link>
		<dc:creator>Today’s post, in which I make nice with LADOT &#171; BikingInLA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 00:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1788</guid>
		<description>[...] it’s fun, informative and free; what more could you want?) A Boston cyclist writes about trusting total strangers with his life everyday. Portland asks if the local cycling scene is too white. Do mandatory helmet [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] it’s fun, informative and free; what more could you want?) A Boston cyclist writes about trusting total strangers with his life everyday. Portland asks if the local cycling scene is too white. Do mandatory helmet [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1786</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 22:46:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1786</guid>
		<description>&quot;did you read the last part of this post?&quot;

You want me to read every last word of your misguided post and parse everything you wrote? Those are some high expectations.

Yes, it is better for cyclists to run red lights.  It&#039;s safer for cyclists in general to get ahead of cars in urban areas.  And if motorists have the expectation that bicycles are always going to run red lights and stop signs, they will ultimately not expect them to.  

Our court system could very easily find that requiring cyclists to stop at stop signs is incorrect.  There is no reason that mass disobedience of the law wouldn&#039;t achieve this outcome.  Do New York City cops routinely give out tickets for jaywalking?  San Francisco cops for panhandling?

There are definitely ways to improve safety for cyclists that cost basically zero dollars:

1) Ban right turns on red.  Aside from informing the public of the new requirement and a political fight, the cost is zero.  There are no signs forbidding right turns on red in New York, but people know the law.

2) Increase traffic fines.  Again, no up-front cost other than the political fight.  In the long-run, this could fund enforcement and infrastructure improvement.

3) Refuse to enforce the law as respects bicycles.  If cities can stop enforcing laws pertaining to small-time drug trafficking, then they can stop ticketing cyclists for disobeying stop sign and red light laws.

Show some imagination.  A &quot;courteous&quot; cyclist is just as likely to get hit by a car.  Otherwise we wouldn&#039;t need any bike infrastructure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;did you read the last part of this post?&#8221;</p>
<p>You want me to read every last word of your misguided post and parse everything you wrote? Those are some high expectations.</p>
<p>Yes, it is better for cyclists to run red lights.  It&#8217;s safer for cyclists in general to get ahead of cars in urban areas.  And if motorists have the expectation that bicycles are always going to run red lights and stop signs, they will ultimately not expect them to.  </p>
<p>Our court system could very easily find that requiring cyclists to stop at stop signs is incorrect.  There is no reason that mass disobedience of the law wouldn&#8217;t achieve this outcome.  Do New York City cops routinely give out tickets for jaywalking?  San Francisco cops for panhandling?</p>
<p>There are definitely ways to improve safety for cyclists that cost basically zero dollars:</p>
<p>1) Ban right turns on red.  Aside from informing the public of the new requirement and a political fight, the cost is zero.  There are no signs forbidding right turns on red in New York, but people know the law.</p>
<p>2) Increase traffic fines.  Again, no up-front cost other than the political fight.  In the long-run, this could fund enforcement and infrastructure improvement.</p>
<p>3) Refuse to enforce the law as respects bicycles.  If cities can stop enforcing laws pertaining to small-time drug trafficking, then they can stop ticketing cyclists for disobeying stop sign and red light laws.</p>
<p>Show some imagination.  A &#8220;courteous&#8221; cyclist is just as likely to get hit by a car.  Otherwise we wouldn&#8217;t need any bike infrastructure.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ron Newman</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1785</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:46:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1785</guid>
		<description>If bicyclists truly treat red lights as stop signs -- meaning that they don&#039;t have the right of way, and need to yield to pedestrians and conflicting traffic -- then they can have no negative effect on anyone else.    

Cyclists zooming through a red light at 18 mph is a different issue entirely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If bicyclists truly treat red lights as stop signs &#8212; meaning that they don&#8217;t have the right of way, and need to yield to pedestrians and conflicting traffic &#8212; then they can have no negative effect on anyone else.    </p>
<p>Cyclists zooming through a red light at 18 mph is a different issue entirely.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ramonchu</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1783</link>
		<dc:creator>ramonchu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:20:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1783</guid>
		<description>give me a break; drivers are trusting that we as bicyclists will continue respecting THEIR traffic laws that systematically discriminate against us in every way. When there was a whole system of laws that discriminated against certain groups of people in this country, did those people just keep reaffirming the hollow rotten social order you might refer to as &quot;trust?&quot; Or did they break the law knowing it was discriminatory, flout it as backwards and raise awareness of it as such, until a solid movement of people were mobilized to stop taking the BS and start creating a world that they knew to be better? Of course they did, this is America, it&#039;s called direct democracy!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>give me a break; drivers are trusting that we as bicyclists will continue respecting THEIR traffic laws that systematically discriminate against us in every way. When there was a whole system of laws that discriminated against certain groups of people in this country, did those people just keep reaffirming the hollow rotten social order you might refer to as &#8220;trust?&#8221; Or did they break the law knowing it was discriminatory, flout it as backwards and raise awareness of it as such, until a solid movement of people were mobilized to stop taking the BS and start creating a world that they knew to be better? Of course they did, this is America, it&#8217;s called direct democracy!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Boston Biker</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1782</link>
		<dc:creator>Boston Biker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1782</guid>
		<description>mark: did you read the last part of this post?

&quot;There are other ways (better infrastructure, better enforcement) but they all cost a lot of money, and can not be implemented tonight on your ride home.&quot;

There is no magic here...and this was largely an argument against running red lights (in our current system with our current laws), do you disagree and instead feel it is good for everyone if cyclists run red lights?  I would be interested in hearing your argument.

It is very unlikely that an Idaho stop style law is going to be passed any time soon in Boston.  

Do you propose treating red lights like stop signs until the law falls under the pressure of the collective law breaking?  Or would that be a mis-characterization of your argument?  

Please enlighten.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mark: did you read the last part of this post?</p>
<p>&#8220;There are other ways (better infrastructure, better enforcement) but they all cost a lot of money, and can not be implemented tonight on your ride home.&#8221;</p>
<p>There is no magic here&#8230;and this was largely an argument against running red lights (in our current system with our current laws), do you disagree and instead feel it is good for everyone if cyclists run red lights?  I would be interested in hearing your argument.</p>
<p>It is very unlikely that an Idaho stop style law is going to be passed any time soon in Boston.  </p>
<p>Do you propose treating red lights like stop signs until the law falls under the pressure of the collective law breaking?  Or would that be a mis-characterization of your argument?  </p>
<p>Please enlighten.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1781</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 17:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1781</guid>
		<description>This is deeply unpersuasive.  How does any of this magically make my ride safer?  Drivers will still door me, or rub me out into parked cars or turn across my path.

The rules need to be changed - as they have in Idaho and Portland - to create a safe environment for cyclists.  The law, as it stands, was designed in the 1950s to maximize car flow.  For example, right turns on red are horribly dangerous for pedestrians, but they sure are great for drivers.

You really need to question why things are the way they are, instead of accepting a situation that&#039;s dangerous for you as a rider.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is deeply unpersuasive.  How does any of this magically make my ride safer?  Drivers will still door me, or rub me out into parked cars or turn across my path.</p>
<p>The rules need to be changed &#8211; as they have in Idaho and Portland &#8211; to create a safe environment for cyclists.  The law, as it stands, was designed in the 1950s to maximize car flow.  For example, right turns on red are horribly dangerous for pedestrians, but they sure are great for drivers.</p>
<p>You really need to question why things are the way they are, instead of accepting a situation that&#8217;s dangerous for you as a rider.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://bostonbiker.org/2009/10/28/you-cant-trust-anyone-these-days/comment-page-1/#comment-1780</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 16:53:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bostonbiker.org/?p=1824#comment-1780</guid>
		<description>This got me thinking (and this is a kind of stream of consciousness comment, so bear with me), about the fact that our culture is extremely alarmist. We paint everything as potentially dangerous, and everyone is talking all the time about how dangerous some or the other thing is. Essentially, we have people crying wolf at us the entire time we&#039;re awake. What this does, is that when something is really actually dangerous (like driving a car at 50mph, for instance), it doesn&#039;t get any attention, because, well, everything is dangerous, including you walking on the sidewalk near said 50mph car.

I think this scares us away from being in our communities and public spaces and it also distracts attention from solving the actual problems, the things that really do cause danger, and instead gets a lot of people trying to change behaviors which really aren&#039;t dangerous, or wouldn&#039;t be if the actual cause of the danger were removed, just to partly mitigate the danger and make themselves feel a little better about it.

I think bicycle helmets and neon or reflective clothing both fit in this category. Sure, there is some small mitigation of danger by wearing a helmet or bright clothing. However, in general, riding a bicycle is not inherently dangerous, what makes it dangerous (largely) is the automobiles they share space with. But people get so caught up on the helmet issue particularly, that they all forget that the real problem here is high traffic speeds and irresponsible drivers/riders, not helmets (or lack thereof). Very nearly every single death on a bicycle in the U.S. is in a collision with an automobile, and helmets and bright clothing don&#039;t change that fact.

So, let&#039;s stop being so alarmist, look at danger where it actually exists and is worth doing something about, see it for what it is, and work at solving real problems instead of just trying to put a million band-aids on things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This got me thinking (and this is a kind of stream of consciousness comment, so bear with me), about the fact that our culture is extremely alarmist. We paint everything as potentially dangerous, and everyone is talking all the time about how dangerous some or the other thing is. Essentially, we have people crying wolf at us the entire time we&#8217;re awake. What this does, is that when something is really actually dangerous (like driving a car at 50mph, for instance), it doesn&#8217;t get any attention, because, well, everything is dangerous, including you walking on the sidewalk near said 50mph car.</p>
<p>I think this scares us away from being in our communities and public spaces and it also distracts attention from solving the actual problems, the things that really do cause danger, and instead gets a lot of people trying to change behaviors which really aren&#8217;t dangerous, or wouldn&#8217;t be if the actual cause of the danger were removed, just to partly mitigate the danger and make themselves feel a little better about it.</p>
<p>I think bicycle helmets and neon or reflective clothing both fit in this category. Sure, there is some small mitigation of danger by wearing a helmet or bright clothing. However, in general, riding a bicycle is not inherently dangerous, what makes it dangerous (largely) is the automobiles they share space with. But people get so caught up on the helmet issue particularly, that they all forget that the real problem here is high traffic speeds and irresponsible drivers/riders, not helmets (or lack thereof). Very nearly every single death on a bicycle in the U.S. is in a collision with an automobile, and helmets and bright clothing don&#8217;t change that fact.</p>
<p>So, let&#8217;s stop being so alarmist, look at danger where it actually exists and is worth doing something about, see it for what it is, and work at solving real problems instead of just trying to put a million band-aids on things.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
